General Flyers discussion -  Anyone not care about Gagne anymore?notify me whenever anyone posts in this discussionSubscribe  
 
From: Kuato  Nov-3 1:01 pm 
To: ALL  (1 of 57) 
 59959.1 

I don't have any animosity towards the man, but I don't care if he ever suits up again.

The injuries, the long stretches in which he does nothing, and the fact that the team has proven before they can win without him...I'm done with this guy.

If he's in the line up and contributing, great. But if he never plays again in the O&B, I don't think it's a big blow to the team.

 
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From: xlpizza  Nov-3 1:19 pm 
To: Kuato  (2 of 57) 
 59959.2 in reply to 59959.1 

<<"I don't have any animosity towards the man, but I don't care if he ever suits up again.">>

I sort of get where you are coming from with this sentiment?

But Gagne, is valuable when healthy which he has been for the most part of his career. It will be just 3 seasons out of 10 where he will miss significant time so he hasn't been an injury riddled player throughout his tenure here.

But more importantly, with the emergence of Giroux and JVR Gagne, can be asked to a little less offensively now and be that strong two way presence that is needed to win in the post season.
I have always thought he was a rung or two below the top LW's in the game. Not that he was a bad player just not as good as some of the players ahead of him but he was our top LW for many years once LeClaire, moved on.

Once he recovers and gets back on the ice he should be used in more of that checking role first then scoring LW. Sort of like Zetterburg or Yzerman late in his career.
I think there is finally enough offensive talent on this team where Simon, doesn't have to be considered the go to guy anymore.
Take some of the load off his shoulders and he will probably flourish as a shutdown winger who will capitalize on scoring opportunities because he has great scoring touch.

Just one man's opinion but he has a lot of good hockey left in him to play either here or somewhere else?

"I have ways of making money that you know nothing of." John D. Rockefeller "The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets." John D. Rockefeller http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/esp_sociopol_cfr_video04.htm "The very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings." John F. Kennedy
 
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From: Kuato  Nov-3 1:24 pm 
To: xlpizza  (3 of 57) 
 59959.3 in reply to 59959.2 

When healthy (and not on a cold streak) he can be a very good player. However, if he's so vital, why do they seem to get by without him?

This isn't just about right now either.

 
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From: xlpizza  Nov-3 1:44 pm 
To: Kuato  (4 of 57) 
 59959.4 in reply to 59959.3 

<<"However, if he's so vital, why do they seem to get by without him?">>

Where did I say that he was vital??

What I did say was since JL left he has been considered this teams best LW'er.
But as you point out hey have been able to make up for him not being in the line up when he has been out of it.

But what they haven't been able to do is overcome when he has been shut down or cold in the post season.
That has more to do with the team being thin at LW in years past and I think there is now finally some better depth emerging where he no longer has to be the the go to guy.
His defensive game is top notch and is rarely an issue at all for him.

I think it would be smart for the organization to transition him from the top line LW into a more checking line role and not ask him to be a top scorer.
Let his natural abilities work for him as a top shut down LW who is going to cash in when he gets chances to score because he has the hands and speed to do so when healthy.

"I have ways of making money that you know nothing of." John D. Rockefeller "The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets." John D. Rockefeller http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/esp_sociopol_cfr_video04.htm "The very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings." John F. Kennedy
 
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From: orangejulius  Nov-3 1:54 pm 
To: Kuato  (5 of 57) 
 59959.5 in reply to 59959.1 

No offense, but you'd have to be pretty thick to "not care" about a guy who netted 35 goals, 40 assists and a plus 21 last year.

I mean, that's like a Caps fan saying he doesn't care about Alex Semin because Ovechkin is on the team too.

Sorry, but it's a bit ridiculous.

You want him healthy and you want him scoring or you're not a Flyer fan.

Even if you want him traded, healthy and scoring is worth more to this team.

It's time to discern the Devil from the Advocate on this one folks. He and DB are very good very productive players.

IF they can be healthy, they both make this team much much better.



Edited 11/3/2009 1:55 pm ET by orangejulius
 
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From: VanFlyer  Nov-3 2:07 pm 
To: xlpizza  (6 of 57) 
 59959.6 in reply to 59959.4 

"Where did I say that he was vital??"

You didn't, but 5.25 in cap is vital.

 
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From: xlpizza  Nov-3 3:34 pm 
To: VanFlyer unread  (7 of 57) 
 59959.7 in reply to 59959.6 

<<"You didn't, but 5.25 in cap is vital.">>

Just because he is earning 5.25 in salary doesn't mean he couldn't be asked to be more of a defensive forward and not relied upon to be the 'go to' top LW.

There are a whole host of players who earn salaries in the similar ball park for what Gagne, does when healthy. He is far from over paid and not wort his deal. There are still a lot of miles on his hockey odometer.

Prior to this season the team has been thin at LW and he was considered their best option as the top LW.
Last year his numbers again proved when healthy he can be very productive as a top LW.
He could recover from this injury and pick up where he left off last season with scoring goals again and be worth every penny on that 5.25M.

Again, fans get too consumed in the numbers when it comes to sports.

"I have ways of making money that you know nothing of." John D. Rockefeller "The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets." John D. Rockefeller http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/esp_sociopol_cfr_video04.htm "The very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings." John F. Kennedy
 
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From: rickmac19  Nov-3 3:55 pm 
To: Kuato  (8 of 57) 
 59959.8 in reply to 59959.1 

He's got to start sticking his nose where it doesn't belong. If he doesn't either create traffic or play in traffic (and plays like the guy we've seen so far this year,) then it's time to adjust his attitude or his location.

He's been such a fantastic player for the Flyers--I will keep holding out hope that he gets healthy and plays 100% hockey.

His 5.25 gets really heavy after a while with no help (35 goals) to lift it.

 
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From: puckhead7  Nov-3 4:08 pm 
To: Kuato  (9 of 57) 
 59959.9 in reply to 59959.1 
Eric will not be missed....
 
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From: eshake  Nov-3 4:19 pm 
To: xlpizza  (10 of 57) 
 59959.10 in reply to 59959.7 

when healthy, there are few LW i'd take before gagne for his great 2 way play....and CONTINUOUS goal scoring ability.

the rate at which people on this board want to axe certainly players is mind blowing.

 
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From: orangejulius  Nov-3 4:38 pm 
To: rickmac19 unread  (11 of 57) 
 59959.11 in reply to 59959.8 

Did you ever think that adjusting how he was playing so far this year is why he kept asking for doctors and telling people something was wrong with his groin/abs?

The fact that he's hurt is a bytch and it sucks. That's something to talk about... but all this "desire" and "attitude" "threshold of pain" and "doesn't want to be here" stuff is based off nothing at all.

Let's get a grip on reality a little bit.

If we can't get at least a little grip on reality I say we skip straight to the "Trade Gagne for J. BO" threads.

 
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From: flyrs7677  Nov-3 5:40 pm 
To: Kuato  (12 of 57) 
 59959.12 in reply to 59959.1 
Gagne Who? I like his replacement, David Laliberte..
 
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From: usaflyer1197  Nov-4 12:05 am 
To: Kuato  (13 of 57) 
 59959.13 in reply to 59959.1 
Wow what a short memory some people have. Yea he has been going down long term lately. But what about the huge goals he scored for us in the ECC against Tampa. Where is the loyalty man?
 
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From: crownroyal  Nov-4 12:22 am 
To: usaflyer1197  (14 of 57) 
 59959.14 in reply to 59959.13 

This thread is making me feel ill.

Everyone needs to chillax for a hot minute. Do you think this guy wants to be injured and going under the knife? Injuries happen. Grow up. (not you usa, the other clowns here)

 
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From: usaflyer1197  Nov-4 12:41 am 
To: crownroyal  (15 of 57) 
 59959.15 in reply to 59959.14 
You and me both. The guy has been a true Flyer for a long time now and has scored many big goals and he gets this treatment. So he got a concussion and had some groin and hip issues the last few years.
 
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From: Dynamo47  Nov-4 6:20 am 
To: Kuato  (16 of 57) 
 59959.16 in reply to 59959.1 

I care in the fact that he recovers but as far as the Flyers are concerned I think it will help as it will mean more ice time for Giroux and JVR.

Granted he did score 34 goals last year and is always a two way player but his goals were very quiet last year.

I honestly thought they should have explored trading him in the offseason while his value was high again.

Al Morganti on WIP "They finally found Osama Bin Laden - He was on Versus".
 
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From: crownroyal  Nov-4 10:21 am 
To: usaflyer1197  (17 of 57) 
 59959.17 in reply to 59959.15 

>So he got a concussion and had some groin and hip issues the last few years.

Serving the club! Some people here are flippin we-todd-id!

 
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From: Kuato  Nov-4 11:51 am 
To: xlpizza  (18 of 57) 
 59959.18 in reply to 59959.4 

"Where did I say that he was vital??"

Relax boss, I asked you a question. I didn't accuse you of anything.

I would be fine with him in a more defensive role. I remember when he was having issue (health) a few years ago I was at the point where I said I'd be happy with 25/25 and good defense from him. I still feel that way. 40-50 points and (I'm talking a top PK type of defensive play) I'm happy.

However, I think since Hitch left he has now shown the same commitment to D.



Edited 11/4/2009 11:53 am ET by Kuato
 
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From: Kuato  Nov-4 11:57 am 
To: orangejulius unread  (19 of 57) 
 59959.19 in reply to 59959.5 

"You want him healthy and you want him scoring or you're not a Flyer fan."

I can take a lot of things. However, one thing I cannot stand is loyalist, apologetic, "I'm a better fan than you are because I'm a homer" type of mentality.

So this whole, you either like him or don't or you're not a fan crap can stop right here. Check your arrogant, superior opinion at the door or I have no interest in continuing this or any conversation with you.

That's my kind way of telling you to piss off. I won't be nice again.

Now back to the conversation at hand...

Nowhere did I say I hated or disliked him. Nowhere did I say he's garbage. In fact, I made sure to try and NOT say that. But it didn't seem to sink in with you.

Gagne has talent. Nobody in their right mind would dispute that. What I did say though, is his talent seemingly isn't very vital to the team's success.

Can you tell me any instances where the team was so bad without him, it was very apparent he's important to the team's success?

 
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From: Kuato  Nov-4 12:02 pm 
To: puckhead7  (20 of 57) 
 59959.20 in reply to 59959.9 

I don't know if that's exactly a fair comparison. Big Baby E was a P in the A, make no mistakes. He also didn't always live up to expectations.

However, there's time's that man strapped the team on his back. While his career can ultimately be viewed as not living up to it's potential, he was (at times) a game changer.

I do not think you can say the same thing about Gags. If anything, I'd say E's presence was missed more than Gags.

 
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